I-140 EB2 Denied AMIE Qualification

[amiesuffer]

immi2002,

can you mail me at ihtavrap . ilagnor @ gmail . com;

we can discuss more on this

[AMIE Raju]

The language used by EDGE to describe the value of the Associate Membership is the same language used to describe the value of a degree like a Bachelor of Technology degree. Specifically, they both say: "This represents attainment of a level of education comparable to Bachelors degree in the United States."

The reason that the AAO has a problem with accepting the AMIE as meeting the degree requirement from IEI or Associate Membership from the ICAI, etc. is the AAO says because these institutions are not themselves a university. If you read the AAO decisions dismissing such appeals and denying the I-140 petitions, this is where the case falls apart. This is why when AAO does approve such cases they are usually in EB3 Skilled Worker classification, and not in EB2.

Now, while the AAO's reliance on the EDGE database may itself be fraught with legal problems - and someone interested in challenging the AAO and USCIS in Federal Court is welcome to contact the Murthy Law Firm about such a case, the language that the EDGE database uses now or in the future is unlikely to make a difference.

People might have better success at winning EB2 classification for an AMIE in trying to prove that the IEI educational program does meet the definition of the term "university." We have yet to see this happen though.

Murthy Attorney: Could you please comment on why USCIS is quoting in many denial decisions that the Bachelor degree should only be awarded from College or University though as per immigration law for EB-2 Advanced degree professional says,

For classification as a member of the professions, the regulation at 8 C.F.R. 5 204.5(1)(3)(ii)© requires the submission of "an official college or university record showing the date the baccalaureate degree was awarded and the area of concentration of study." The commentary accompanying the proposed advanced degree professional regulation specifically states that a "baccalaureate means a bachelor's degree received from a college or university, or an equivalent degree."

Question is; since this qualification is already recognized by AACRAO EDGE, U.S. Department of Education, Indian government and many more, then why USCIS is not considering as an equivalent degree.

[skotgc]

Hi

There are so many AMIE sufferers, so please count me in as well. I think money is not a problem, we can all contribute if there is a way to find a solution for this problem. I think we should probably start a google or yahoo group. This is better instead individually contacting.

If any of you located near to Murthy's office, could you please visit them and find out if they can take up something. I am not sure if Institute of engineers can do something about this as well.

Thank you

[vdvrm]

Hi All

Please count me also.I have Diploma in Mechanical(3 years full time)+AMIE computer Engineering+11 years of IT experience. Recently my EB2 I140 has been denied by stating that :

The evidence in this case fails to demonstrate that IEI is a degree granting collage or university that awards Bachelor's degrees or advance degrees.The IEI confers professional credentilas, not formal academic credentials.As such the beneficiary's passage of the institution examination would not equate to a four U.S Bachelor degree conferred after a full course of academic study.

Is there any thing all we can do about this? what are the possible options available for me in this situation? If I do MS/M-tech on line is it going to help in future? which is the best university in US that acceptes AMIE to do MS online and recognized by USCIS?

Please advise. Let us form up a team and do some justice to ourselves. All we know how tough it is to pass AMIE.

Regards.

[skotgc]

Hi

I am very happy to see a response. I think you can pursue MS, University of Phoenix admits AMIE degree holders for sure. I think some other universities are also fine.

BTW: We can also try for some action from Institution of Engineers as well. Please send an email to Secretary and director general and director Dr. A. K> Gupta and request them to do something for our members. I just sent an email. At least lets give it a try, if more members do so, they will respond.

Thanks

[ryagnik]

I am willing to put any effort including financial efforts to make sure AMIE comes under EB2.I can pull few others as well.

I am also doing my online MS from Capitol College.Do let me know If you need more information.

Let all work togather as we all worked hard for AMIE.

Thanks,

One of AMIE from you all..

[ryagnik]

I have created a google group for AMIE-EB2.

Here is the link :

https://************************

I am requesting you to join this group,let us put all the efforts.

Thanks,

AMIEANS

[BigJoe5]

http://www.uscis.gov/err/B5%20-%20Members%20of%20the%20Professions%20holding%20Advanced%20Degrees%20or%20Aliens%20of%20Exceptional%20Ability/Decisions_Issued_in_2011/Aug242011_02B5203.pdf

AAO discusses EDGE in this Aug 24, 2011 case at this linkl.

[skotgc]

Hi

Could you just specify the group name? The link is blocked in this.

I have sent a mail to Institute and Dr. Gupta acknowledged that they are looking into the matter. I request others to do the same, so they can assess how many are impacted. The more the best. email to exams at ieindia.org

thank you all

I have created a google group for AMIE-EB2.

Here is the link :

https://************************

I am requesting you to join this group,let us put all the efforts.

Thanks,

AMIEANS

[AMIE Raju]

Murthy Attorney: Could you please comment on why USCIS is quoting in many denial decisions that the Bachelor degree should only be awarded from College or University though as per immigration law for EB-2 Advanced degree professional says,

For classification as a member of the professions, the regulation at 8 C.F.R. 5 204.5(1)(3)(ii)© requires the submission of "an official college or university record showing the date the baccalaureate degree was awarded and the area of concentration of study." The commentary accompanying the proposed advanced degree professional regulation specifically states that a "baccalaureate means a bachelor's degree received from a college or university, or an equivalent degree."

Question is; since this qualification is already recognized by AACRAO EDGE, U.S. Department of Education, Indian government and many more, then why USCIS is not considering as an equivalent degree.

Murthy Attorney Please advise: As you have mentioned in your earlier reply that Institution of Engineers India is not an University or College is the main issue in EB-2. Since IEI is estabished in 1935 by Britsh King and awarded a Royal Charter (which still has legal status in India even after 77 years). This Royal charter (clause 2e and 2f) clearly fits in the term definition of "University".

As per definition of term University (see these links)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University

https://www.ieindia.info/PDF_Images/royalchar/Royal%20Charter.pdf

Your's reply is greatly appreciated since this is the only legal point for EB-2 we have to resolve for this qualification for the benefit of many GRADUATE from IEI.

[skotgc]

The google group name is AMIE-EB2, please opt in and we can share our ideas,

[ryagnik]

Please do join AMIE-EB2 group by sending mail at following mail id :

amie-eb2 at googlegroups dot com

[ryagnik]

Hello,

I already have a AACRAO and WES evaluation (course by course evaluation) which showing equivalency of US Bachelor's degree.

Do you all think expert opinion letter will help us further ? And let us decide which agency can help us ?

I have researched a bit and thought one of the NACES member can help us to prove AMIE Institute is one kind of specialized university.

Foundation for International Services, Inc. provides an expert opinion letter service,do you all think that will help ?

Let us make this thread alive and I am urging people to join AMIE-EB2 group.

[ryagnik]

Let us involve our Institute.

I have send a mail to our institute asking for further clarification about what statue does our institute carries for further education ? Is this a college OR university ?

Once I will have reply,I will share it with you all.

[ryagnik]

I have received reply from IE and It described how courses are conducted by IE.

It does not mention anything about college or degree.It clearly says IE is an engineering society.

Do let me know if any one needs that document.

[tigerrr1]

My EB3 140 is also challenged because of AMIE degree. Can you please tell me what was the education requirement on your EB3 labor and was your EB3 140 filed under skilled worker or professional

Highly appreciate your Immidiately response

I have EB3 I-140 approved in 2008 under the EB3(2) professional catagory based on AMIE. Educatin evaluation stated that passaing section A and B is equivalent to US Bachelor's. I was planning to go for re doing under EB2 mid of next year, but all the forums I see so far show discouraging results for trying EB2 with AMIE+5 yrs.

[tigerrr1]

The language used by EDGE to describe the value of the Associate Membership is the same language used to describe the value of a degree like a Bachelor of Technology degree. Specifically, they both say: "This represents attainment of a level of education comparable to Bachelors degree in the United States."

The reason that the AAO has a problem with accepting the AMIE as meeting the degree requirement from IEI or Associate Membership from the ICAI, etc. is the AAO says because these institutions are not themselves a university. If you read the AAO decisions dismissing such appeals and denying the I-140 petitions, this is where the case falls apart. This is why when AAO does approve such cases they are usually in EB3 Skilled Worker classification, and not in EB2.

Now, while the AAO's reliance on the EDGE database may itself be fraught with legal problems - and someone interested in challenging the AAO and USCIS in Federal Court is welcome to contact the Murthy Law Firm about such a case, the language that the EDGE database uses now or in the future is unlikely to make a difference.

People might have better success at winning EB2 classification for an AMIE in trying to prove that the IEI educational program does meet the definition of the term "university." We have yet to see this happen though.

Hello attorney_15. Based on just AMIE, I have I-140 approved under EB3(i) or (ii), skilled worker or professional catagory, in 2008. I was planning to re-do under EB2 catagory mid of 2013 based on AMIE+5yrs experience, but all the forum discussion are discouraging to even try that. To your point about trying to prove that IEI program does meet the definition of "University" , what do you suggest we should do? What is required to prove that?

[raju77]

i am also in same situation my 140 got denied because of AMIE

please help me any way to get approval

[tigerrr1]

On 9/9/2012 at 11:46 AM, tigerrr1 said:

Hello attorney_15. Based on just AMIE, I have I-140 approved under EB3(i) or (ii), skilled worker or professional catagory, in 2008. I was planning to re-do under EB2 catagory mid of 2013 based on AMIE+5yrs experience, but all the forum discussion are discouraging to even try that. To your point about trying to prove that IEI program does meet the definition of "University" , what do you suggest we should do? What is required to prove that?

Don't know if anyone is pursuing everything discussed in this thread, but I wanted to update my status , so that, it may be useful for some one visiting this thread in future.

My Prioirty date - Mar2008... First I-140 (EB3 based on AMIE ) approved ~ mid 2009.... While waiting in queue, I pursued a Master's degree in business & engineering from Lehigh University, Pennsylvania... Lehigh University is a very good, accredited, engineering & business school, and they had no problem accepting AMIE as a basis for my Master's degree application... Of course, I had to take GRE/GMAT to qualify to get in, in addition to AMIE degree.

After finishing Masters in 2014, and a job change along the way, I applied my second I-140 (EB2 based on AMIE & US Masters in ~Jan 2016.. Got rejected based on AMIE .. MTR applied June2016 to consider US Masters... approved in June2017..... I-485 filed - 10Aug2017 ..... finished interview February and received GC early March2018.. Just like many folks from India, I have been waiting over 10 years now. I had a very rocky I-140 experience due to AMIE, but finally they approved EB2 based on US Masters degree.... I-485 experience has been smooth...

As of the date of this note, seems like EB3 is moving quite fast (relative to last decade), so may be some of you who filed around 2008 or before in EB3 with AMIE may be receiving your GC's soon.. But for those who filed later, or planning to pursue GC in future based on AMIE, your best bet is to, first apply in EB3 based on AMIE and get at least one I-140 approved to establish a basis to stay in US, and then pursue a part time Masters degree from an accredited university.. Many regular universities offer part time Master's degrees with classes in evenings (Lehigh University is one of them) and also offer many online courses... After the Masters, apply for EB2 I-140 again and pursue that path.. Again, this makes sense only if EB2 priority date moves forward considerably compared to EB3.. As of this date, looks like EB3 and EB2 are not too far from each other, due to significant upgrading of EB3 to EB2, but if EB2 starts moving faster in future, getting an MS degree may be the best option. ...

Finishing AMIE itself is hard enough, but unfortunately not enough for USCIS for EB2, although recognized by all universities & Government in India, as well as many universities abroad.   Unless something changes, the best bet for us is a Masters degree based EB2 application for now, or pursuing career in other equally attractive countries like Germany, Canada or India.. 

Edited April 23, 2018 by tigerrr1

[Sivainus]

Hi, i am new to this forum. I am in H1b. the organization is reviewing my docs for perm. i am a 12+ 3year diploma electronics and communication engineering + 3 year bachelors in business administration + 3 year bachelor science information systems from bits pilani. can any one tell if my education qualify for eb2/eb3 or not.