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harsha413

Is day trading legal or illegal on H1B status...

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I am on H1B. I want to know whether day trading (buying and selling same stock multiple times in a day) is legal or not on H1B? I an not a professional trader. I am an individual non-professional trader. So can i do day trading ot not?

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Day trading is considered work, and you can not do that since on H1, you can only work for your employer.

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You are wrong on this one. One can do 3 day trades over a period of 5 calender days unless he satisfies some margin requirement based on SEC rules. I don't think being on H1B prevents you from doing day trading or even trading on stocks provided its done via a retail brokerage account. I am on H1B and I have done some day trading and as expected paid taxes on capital gain in my tax return.

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You are wrong on this one. One can do 3 day trades over a period of 5 calendar days unless he satisfies some margin requirement based on SEC rules. I don't think being on H1B prevents you from doing day trading or even trading on stocks provided its done via a retail brokerage account. I am on H1B and I have done some day trading and as expected paid taxes on capital gain in my tax return.

Because you have done this, doesn't change the law. Doing day-trading involves work. Work without authorization is illegal. It's against the law. Any reference saying that "3 day trades over a period of 5 calendar days" doesn't count as work? On the other hand, investing in long term stocks doesn't count as work.

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You are wrong on this one. One can do 3 day trades over a period of 5 calender days unless he satisfies some margin requirement based on SEC rules.

Sigh.

When will people learn that this is about what USCIS considers work, not about what the SEC thinks.

Day trading is considered work, and you can NOT NOT NOT do that while on H1, because on H1, you can only work for your employer.

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Because you have done this, doesn't change the law. Doing day-trading involves work. Work without authorization is illegal. It's against the law. Any reference saying that "3 day trades over a period of 5 calendar days" doesn't count as work? On the other hand, investing in long term stocks doesn't count as work.

And do you have any reference saying that "Day Trading (on personal capacity) is work" ? I have seen Attorney's arguing on both sides.

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JoeF you think you know everything. Here is an excerpt from one of the immigration lawyer

The reality is, you cannot day trading as a full time job because you are sponsored H1B visa and should work full time for your primary job or company full time. Day trading may be done on and off, but it should not be done so much that it takes away time away from your primary job.

Show me the USCIS clarification on day trade.

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JoeF you think you know everything. Here is an excerpt from one of the immigration lawyer

The reality is, you cannot day trading as a full time job because you are sponsored H1B visa and should work full time for your primary job or company full time. Day trading may be done on and off, but it should not be done so much that it takes away time away from your primary job.

Show me the USCIS clarification on day trade.

It’s time to consider better attorney. The work is not supposed to be full time or interfering fulltime authorized job to be classified as illegal work. Suppose, I work part time as bar-tender in weekend and not interfering my fulltime H1b job, isn't it legal?

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It’s time to consider better attorney. The work is not supposed to be full time or interfering fulltime authorized job to be classified as illegal work. Suppose, I work part time as bar-tender in weekend and not interfering my fulltime H1b job, isn't it legal?

Your analogy to bar-tender does not hold. On H1 you cannot be a bar-tender under certain circumstance and be a bar-tender under other circumstance.

The point here is --- Stock trading is allowed in H1 . The dispute lies on whether Day trading is OK. I am yet to see a single legal reference which says buying and selling on same day is not allowed while buying and selling on different days is allowed. All the arguments have been something like -- it is not allowed (but no answer when asked for reference).

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It’s time to consider better attorney. The work is not supposed to be full time or interfering fulltime authorized job to be classified as illegal work. Suppose, I work part time as bar-tender in weekend and not interfering my fulltime H1b job, isn't it legal?

What if I win a Lottery when Im on H1B..or I sell my house/car and make a profit...would that be illegal?

I think you'll need a better attorney for yourself.

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Show me the USCIS clarification on day trade.

You work fulltime. It is simply not possible to do day trading while you work fulltime. You would have to trade during daytime, which is the time when you work.

So, your day trading would interfere with your work. It in itself is work, and you simply can not do that. Period.

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What if I win a Lottery when Im on H1B..or I sell my house/car and make a profit...would that be illegal?

Apples and oranges.

Selling your house and car is of course not a business.

However, if you "flip" real estate, that is a business, and you can't do that on H1.

Similarly, you can casually trade stock, but you can not do day trading. Day trading is work, and on H1, you can only work for the H1 employer.

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Your analogy to bar-tender does not hold. On H1 you cannot be a bar-tender under certain circumstance and be a bar-tender under other circumstance.

Wrong.

Of course you could entertain guests on the weekend, and tend your personal bar.

But working as a weekend bar tender is not allowed on H1.

Similarly, you can casually trade stock. But you can not be a day trader, because that would be working. It would also interfere with your work, since you can only do that doing the workweek, when you are usually working fulltime for your H1 employer.

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Wrong.

Of course you could entertain guests on the weekend, and tend your personal bar.

But working as a weekend bar tender is not allowed on H1.

Similarly, you can casually trade stock. But you can not be a day trader, because that would be working. It would also interfere with your work, since you can only do that doing the workweek, when you are usually working fulltime for your H1 employer.

Interfering with work argument does not hold water. If that is your argument, the counter argument is , so H4 can do Day Trade because they are not working for any Employer . Is that what you are saying ?

Personal bar analogy does not hold water too. Be it day trade or long term investment, you ALWAYS do it in same place -- in Stock Exchange (online though). So , the Location does not change.

During a stock trade the basics remains the same. You are sure not saying that buying and selling share is not allowed.

The argument is, are you only allowed to sell after you hold it for a certain duration OR can you sell it on same day. The argument is on duration NOT on location or activity.

As I said, I am yet to see a legal reference which says that if you buy a stock today and sell it after (say) a month , you are not violating your H1 status but if you are buying it today and selling it today it violates H1 status.

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You work fulltime. It is simply not possible to do day trading while you work fulltime. You would have to trade during daytime, which is the time when you work.

So, your day trading would interfere with your work. It in itself is work, and you simply can not do that. Period.

Day trading can be automated . You can set it up previous night and both buy and sell will trigger automatically during market hours. Technology has advanced much ..... Further, the argument of "interfering with work" simply says that it is fine for H4s to Day Trade. Is that what you are saying ?

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Wrong.

Of course you could entertain guests on the weekend, and tend your personal bar.

But working as a weekend bar tender is not allowed on H1.

Similarly, you can casually trade stock. But you can not be a day trader, because that would be working. It would also interfere with your work, since you can only do that doing the workweek, when you are usually working fulltime for your H1 employer.

There are flaws in this argument.

If I entertain guests (need not be weekend -- I can do anyday) and be a bartender I will --1) Do it in my home and not in a commercial restaurant or bar (aka different locations) ; 2) Will Not financially gain anything from it.

When I do Casual Stock trading (which we agree is allowed) , I will -- 1) Do it in Stock Exchange (through broker of course) ; 2) Will financially gain (or loss) from it

If I do Day Trading (which you say is not allowed) , I will -- 1) Do it in Stock Exchange (through broker of course) ; 2) Will financially gain (or loss) from it

So, for both Casual Trading AND Day Trading , the location and financial gain/loss remain same . What changes is the duration of holding and frequency .

The analogy you should come up with should be --- everything else remaining same AND I have a financial gain/loss, if I do something infrequently it is allowed, if I do it frequently it is not allowed. Is there anything like that in H1 rules?

Edited by chakrakr

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Day trading can be automated .

Then it clearly is work.

Only casual trading is allowed, not something that requires some elaborate setup.

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As I said, I am yet to see a legal reference which says that if you buy a stock today and sell it after (say) a month , you are not violating your H1 status but if you are buying it today and selling it today it violates H1 status.

There will never be such a legal reference, because then there would have to be 100 million legal references to cover each different situation.

This is simply not how legislation works, nowhere in the world.

I suggest you actually learn about how legislation is done.

It is very clear from the existing legislation that things like day trading are not allowed for somebody on H1.

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You work fulltime. It is simply not possible to do day trading while you work fulltime. You would have to trade during daytime, which is the time when you work.

So, your day trading would interfere with your work. It in itself is work, and you simply can not do that. Period.

Normal trading is allowed on H1 right? So won't that interfere with your full time work? The point is some day trading is allowed period. Else show me the USCIS clarification on this chief.

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There will never be such a legal reference, because then there would have to be 100 million legal references to cover each different situation.

This is simply not how legislation works, nowhere in the world.

I suggest you actually learn about how legislation is done.

It is very clear from the existing legislation that things like day trading are not allowed for somebody on H1.

Care to explain which existing legislation shows that Day Trading is not allowed for H1 but long term trade is allowed ? Stop coming up with things like "it is not allowed because I say so" . If you have a legal reference provide it, if not say it is just your OPINION.

Again, I have already proved that all your arguments from Bartender to "intergering with work" does not hold any water. You need to come up with better arguments instead of "what I say is always right -- no one should question".

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Normal trading is allowed on H1 right?

CASUAL trading is allowed on H1.

Such casual trading can be done during evenings, for example.

The point is some day trading is allowed period. Else show me the USCIS clarification on this chief.

The point is that day trading is work, and on H1, you can ONLY work for your employer.

If you do day trading, you would be working without authorization.

I suggest you look things up in the immigration law.

The bottom line: Day trading is NOT allowed on H1. Period. End of story.

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CASUAL trading is allowed on H1.

Such casual trading can be done during evenings, for example.

The point is that day trading is work, and on H1, you can ONLY work for your employer.

If you do day trading, you would be working without authorization.

I suggest you look things up in the immigration law.

The bottom line: Day trading is NOT allowed on H1. Period. End of story.

It is ONLY you who says Day Trading is Work . And your words without any reference has ZERO weight no matter how much you shout.

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Then it clearly is work.

Only casual trading is allowed, not something that requires some elaborate setup.

I suggest you learn how online trading is done. ANY online trading , including those for long term investment, CAN be done with same setting. Bottomline, Stock buying and selling are done in the EXACT same location, in the EXACT same way no matter you buy and sell on same day or buy today and sell after an year.

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Care to explain which existing legislation shows that Day Trading is not allowed for H1 but long term trade is allowed ?

The immigration law. Check it out some time...

Day trading is work, and on H1, you can only work for your H1 employer. You looking for loopholes doesn't change that.

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The immigration law. Check it out some time...

Day trading is work, and on H1, you can only work for your H1 employer. You looking for loopholes doesn't change that.

Which part of immigration law exactly says Day Trading is work ? In fact, immigration law says that buying and selling stock is allowed on H1/H4 and Day Trading is just that buying and selling stock.

It is YOU who is screaming that Day Trading is work . Occassional Day Trading is allowed on H1 no matter how much you scream..

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