EVC = Suicide !

[ottawa_rocks]

EVC these days = Suicide of your american career and dreams !

In the past, people may have gotten lucky and enjoyed their time in EVC by doing all the poosible fradulent activities possible on the planet.

But rules change, times change, US government have had too much of this desi body shopping business and so came the E-E memorandum and now we are seeing the results.

Advice: Change to a proper JOB or EC model.

EVC is DEAD. JOEF and some other senior folks here have stressed on it, but it seems some of you still are not able to understand it and continue to collect pieces of paper that are basically useless.

Move out, think bigger and put an end to this DESI business and make this entire process smoother and easy for everyone.

[hmaster]

I really don't understand what you are talking about, also I see that you have started multiple threads where you talk only about sad stories at different consulates? EVCs continued to get approved and stamped by the day, if they are legitimate.

[ashukla]

EVC these days = Suicide of your american career and dreams !

In the past, people may have gotten lucky and enjoyed their time in EVC by doing all the poosible fradulent activities possible on the planet.

But rules change, times change, US government have had too much of this desi body shopping business and so came the E-E memorandum and now we are seeing the results.

Advice: Change to a proper JOB or EC model.

EVC is DEAD. JOEF and some other senior folks here have stressed on it, but it seems some of you still are not able to understand it and continue to collect pieces of paper that are basically useless.

Move out, think bigger and put an end to this DESI business and make this entire process smoother and easy for everyone.

I have a disagreement on some of your statement you mentioned here, first of all if it seems like that EVC is not a genuine work model in USA then why USCIS is approving the H1B petitions,

small desi company so called body shops if they dosent suite and are not able to qualify for providing the legal employment then why USCIS is approving petitions from them and collecting money.

Proper job :) what do you assume that a guy who is working in super store would file a H1B for this and pay the taxes more than his salary. Fulltime job, let me tell you any big gaint US company like JPMC, BOA, AIG are not willing to hire you a fulltime employee until unless you are not a GC or citizen, but they are good to have you work with them if you works as a consultant. This only increase the project expenses but company head count might make them to pay more some where. The reason I am telling you this becuase I have my personal experience of same with them.

EC Model- I was on the EC model but it didnt changed any thing, employer is one of the most reputated company in GA you can conclude this by an example that an employee of my employer was nominated for the women of the year. So no problem with employer.

I am not a immigration attorney, simple guy living with what I had achieved in USA, not aware of detailed information of criteria for approving a petition and visa. But if something was wrong with the employer or model, or any thing else then USCIS shouldnt have approved it. moreover I have clean record of 7 years in USA except one speeding ticket so you can assume that I am not a person who is uneligible for Visa.

Conclusion is simple as that if you guys are really looking to stop this body shop business then instead of make suffering simple guys why dont cancel the busienss license of such body shops, stop approving the petition, or do some more enquiry before approving it. No one can stop this until government take some strict inititatives. I know you might be in a sense that before joining the company you should find out more about the company thats completely understandable.

So I would suggest that before approving a petition USCIS should check everything about employer its strength work models or whatever can be considered needs to be verify. Becuase now they are putting a normal guy in trouble if he is leaving the country, Consulates are acting as slaughter house for H1B guys, EVC, EC or what so ever is a model and if it is not acceptable then stop approving the H1 petitions for them. On the name of EER they are simply running the careers of so many guys.

I am not arguing here just sharing my views, and do not want any hot argument on this, if you disagree with me express it in a mannered way that would be appreciable.

Thanks

[permaudit]

EVC these days = Suicide of your american career and dreams !

In the past, people may have gotten lucky and enjoyed their time in EVC by doing all the poosible fradulent activities possible on the planet.

But rules change, times change, US government have had too much of this desi body shopping business and so came the E-E memorandum and now we are seeing the results.

Advice: Change to a proper JOB or EC model.

EVC is DEAD. JOEF and some other senior folks here have stressed on it, but it seems some of you still are not able to understand it and continue to collect pieces of paper that are basically useless.

Move out, think bigger and put an end to this DESI business and make this entire process smoother and easy for everyone.

@ottawa_rocks - Its indeed suicide, but the system is like that not evey one can land as an FTE isnt it? For clients it sometimes becomes hectic to manage the consultants that they hire on a temoporary basis and hence they give out the entire contract to manage these temporary workers to vendor management systems, which intern become layes to us. In such scenarios, we are helpless. Even though there is no direct involvement of the vendor, just because they manage, they would act as layer and would have to be documented in H1 petitions which inturn is becoming a nightmare.

I do understand that the loopholes in he system were capitalized by desi consultancies, but trying to curb such activities, the US government is making it tough for the skiilled people. I dont say that this a wrong procedure, but I feel there could be an effective solution than this, to get rid of these desi consultancies..

[for_suggestion]

@ottawa_rocks - Its indeed suicide, but the system is like that not evey one can land as an FTE isnt it? For clients it sometimes becomes hectic to manage the consultants that they hire on a temoporary basis and hence they give out the entire contract to manage these temporary workers to vendor management systems, which intern become layes to us. In such scenarios, we are helpless. Even though there is no direct involvement of the vendor, just because they manage, they would act as layer and would have to be documented in H1 petitions which inturn is becoming a nightmare.

I do understand that the loopholes in he system were capitalized by desi consultancies, but trying to curb such activities, the US government is making it tough for the skiilled people. I dont say that this a wrong procedure, but I feel there could be an effective solution than this, to get rid of these desi consultancies..

@Ottawa_rocks:

If you have your stamping done,keep quite and concentrate on your job.Don't make fun of others.So many people read these forums.Don't scare them.

[JoeF]

@ottawa_rocks - Its indeed suicide, but the system is like that not evey one can land as an FTE isnt it?

Why not?

[hellow123]

EVC these days = Suicide of your american career and dreams !

In the past, people may have gotten lucky and enjoyed their time in EVC by doing all the poosible fradulent activities possible on the planet.

But rules change, times change, US government have had too much of this desi body shopping business and so came the E-E memorandum and now we are seeing the results.

Advice: Change to a proper JOB or EC model.

EVC is DEAD. JOEF and some other senior folks here have stressed on it, but it seems some of you still are not able to understand it and continue to collect pieces of paper that are basically useless.

Move out, think bigger and put an end to this DESI business and make this entire process smoother and easy for everyone.

Indeed. I totally agree with you. So many people are suffering either by not able to travel to India skipping most important occasions or by getting rejected or so called admin process after the travel. USCIS issuing I797 after verifying all documents and accepting fat cheque. US consulate is simply rejecting which was approved by their own immigration department without returning cheque. Everybody is acting as if no extortion of money is happening with all educated people involved. Its a legal extortion executed by Super power country. The funniest part is VO asks if we have gone through the booklet given prior to the interview and we have right to challenge them. How in this world one can challenge them in US sitting in India. Most of employers won't spare a thought of person stuck in India. No lawmaker or attorney is willing to challenge this 221(g) even after knowing its nothing but bullying after accepting the visa fees. How can VO judge technical credentials of a person traveling?? just by googling they can give their verdict?? Look at their PCs ..u would find multiple good search windows. One stupid VO asked i can't find the tool you mentioned on google. Well.. we are ruled by stupid politicians who thinks they are above from all. I think VOs in India also inspired from our own politicians.. all u face in India consulates who have gone with EVC or sometimes EC model are bullied, treated with so much arrogance and disrespect. I would suggest first try with Canada or some European consulates. At least you would be treated with some respect even your petition was rejected.

[Ottawa221]

Why not?

Joef- I respect you for your legal knowledge. Unfortuanately- your knowledge about the consulting industry is very limited. It will be great if you can keep your advise limited to your area of expertise. Most of us are here to get our doubts cleared on legal matters. I think most of us have the technical skills and industry practices fugured out.

[AxialTilt]

Why not?

@JoeF, step out of your wonderland where you expect everyone to have a fulltime job with good pay, a nice place to live in, a car, clean water everywhere, smooth traffic, beaches with landscape, free time to browse at work and give free advise to people on forums here calling EVC fraud. Well, life is more than that!!! Just because you are in your own wonderland does not mean every where in the world it is the same.

Like @Ottawa21 said, just keep your advise to your area of expertise and stop bashing the consulting industry. All this is just a game played to reduce the number of H-1B's in US. If your hypothetical world ever existed where fulltime employment was the only norm right from the beginning and the consulting industry never ever eixsted, consulates would still come up with some other new game to reduce the numbers. Be happy you are not being played. You are on a mission here bashing the consulting industry all the time. You are doing all this just because you started and finished your game early and are now safe. You don't know how many ways innocent H-1B's are being played here. You just don't get it! All you know is your wonderland with fulltime jobs and calling consulting industry a fraud. If you are so sure consulting industry is fraud, hire an attorney and sue every consulting company, you would make millions.

[abhishekreddy1]

@Joef

Full times are only taken if they have projects that last forever. If they need more people ONLY for one or few projects they will NOT hire full times. If they hire full times and fire after the project, the company's reputation and share value will go down.

[Capri06]

EVC would have been a great model if all those desi people who started their companies had been NOT SO GREEDY FOR DOLLARS and had not tried to find a loop hole for every damn thing, or tried to save money and exploit people. EVC offers benefit to be in a location of your choice. FTE or EC does not, even there you are just another person doing same thing every other day unless you are passionate about what you do.

Of the three models, I think EC is the worst model. Politics, pay, growth, location all suck. Location is the main constraint for me, of course its a much larger question than why most people come here for.

[toashishmantri]

@JoeF, step out of your wonderland where you expect everyone to have a fulltime job with good pay, a nice place to live in, a car, clean water everywhere, smooth traffic, beaches with landscape, free time to browse at work and give free advise to people on forums here calling EVC fraud. Well, life is more than that!!! Just because you are in your own wonderland does not mean every where in the world it is the same.

Like @Ottawa21 said, just keep your advise to your area of expertise and stop bashing the consulting industry. All this is just a game played to reduce the number of H-1B's in US. If your hypothetical world ever existed where fulltime employment was the only norm right from the beginning and the consulting industry never ever eixsted, consulates would still come up with some other new game to reduce the numbers. Be happy you are not being played. You are on a mission here bashing the consulting industry all the time. You are doing all this just because you started and finished your game early and are now safe. You don't know how many ways innocent H-1B's are being played here. You just don't get it! All you know is your wonderland with fulltime jobs and calling consulting industry a fraud. If you are so sure consulting industry is fraud, hire an attorney and sue every consulting company, you would make millions.

I agree with @northwest.bobby.

Most of the american desi Consulting companies

1. dont prepare fake resumes
   
2. dont file fake H1b and then job is done by someone else.
   
3. phone interview are not given by fake people.
   
4. someone with 0 yrs experience but they never show that person as 6-8 yrs experience just to get more hours billing rates
   

desi consulting companies in USA are the most cleanest people in the world. and yes we are not supporting them because we are not playing any part in their business by joining them.

[Desi Dude]

@JoeF, step out of your wonderland where you expect everyone to have a fulltime job with good pay, a nice place to live in, a car, clean water everywhere, smooth traffic, beaches with landscape, free time to browse at work and give free advise to people on forums here calling EVC fraud. Well, life is more than that!!! Just because you are in your own wonderland does not mean every where in the world it is the same.

Like @Ottawa21 said, just keep your advise to your area of expertise and stop bashing the consulting industry. All this is just a game played to reduce the number of H-1B's in US. If your hypothetical world ever existed where fulltime employment was the only norm right from the beginning and the consulting industry never ever eixsted, consulates would still come up with some other new game to reduce the numbers. Be happy you are not being played. You are on a mission here bashing the consulting industry all the time. You are doing all this just because you started and finished your game early and are now safe. You don't know how many ways innocent H-1B's are being played here. You just don't get it! All you know is your wonderland with fulltime jobs and calling consulting industry a fraud. If you are so sure consulting industry is fraud, hire an attorney and sue every consulting company, you would make millions.

Don't get personal, it's not your business how JoeF lives his life. He provides sound advice which is free, take it or leave it.

Almost all consulting companies fake resumes, none of the consultants would get to the interview if their resumes didn't have extra 4-5yrs of experience. Honesty is a big thing in US, they believe what you tell them and desi consultancy companies have been misusing that fact. But now, people are realizing that and taking measures to curb it.

You can't fake resumes in India coz the companies know all the tricks. If you say you have 12yrs of experience, they will ask for your 12th board marksheet and question how you can have so much experience when you graduated from school in so & so year.

A lot of honest & genuine people are unemployed because of these desi consultancies.

[JoeF]

Joef- I respect you for your legal knowledge. Unfortuanately- your knowledge about the consulting industry is very limited.

LOL.

Then enlighten us...

I worked in the consultant industry while on H1, and got my GC from a consulting company, owned by a US citizen, though.

I suggest you learn things before mouthing off...

[JoeF]

@JoeF, step out of your wonderland where you expect everyone to have a fulltime job with good pay, a nice place to live in, a car, clean water everywhere, smooth traffic, beaches with landscape, free time to browse at work and give free advise to people on forums here calling EVC fraud. Well, life is more than that!!! Just because you are in your own wonderland does not mean every where in the world it is the same.

That "wonderland" is what is called reality.

Are you trying to justify living the slum life on H1???

[JoeF]

I agree with @northwest.bobby.

Most of the american desi Consulting companies

1. dont prepare fake resumes
   
2. dont file fake H1b and then job is done by someone else.
   
3. phone interview are not given by fake people.
   
4. someone with 0 yrs experience but they never show that person as 6-8 yrs experience just to get more hours billing rates
   

desi consulting companies in USA are the most cleanest people in the world. and yes we are not supporting them because we are not playing any part in their business by joining them.

I love the sarcasm :)

[JoeF]

@Joef

Full times are only taken if they have projects that last forever. If they need more people ONLY for one or few projects they will NOT hire full times. If they hire full times and fire after the project, the company's reputation and share value will go down.

It is obvious that you have no clue about fulltime jobs...

Fulltime jobs are not about specific projects.

[JoeF]

The amount of astro-turfing in this thread is amazing...

It doesn't change the fact that in particular the so-called desi consulting companies have essentially killed the IT consulting business.

Consulting per se is fine, but these so-called "consulting" companies are nothing more than body shops, and that's dead with the employer-employee relationship memo.

[maverick33]

I think the biggest loss in issuing a 221(g) is the amount of time it consumes to reach a conclusion on a case. While it is quite natural for a office dealing with immigration/visa to be cautious, same time they definitely need to work on a strategy to speed up the process. Holding up a person's case for several months when his/her 's expertise is actually needed in the US for a company just doesn't make sense. Having said that, no one can deny that H1b system has been abused in the past by some petitioners and now the consulates are bent upon abusing the 221(g). Its like a tit for tat game. 221(g)'s best weapon is Employer-Employee relationship. And, the weapon could be definitely be defeated with a close to perfect documentation. Documentation explaining the EER is the key. This may hold true irrespective of any model viz. EC/EVC/EVVC.

--- from a 221(g) victim for 2.5 months.

[toashishmantri]

I think the biggest loss in issuing a 221(g) is the amount of time it consumes to reach a conclusion on a case. While it is quite natural for a office dealing with immigration/visa to be cautious, same time they definitely need to work on a strategy to speed up the process. Holding up a person's case for several months when his/her 's expertise is actually needed in the US for a company just doesn't make sense. Having said that, no one can deny that H1b system has been abused in the past by some petitioners and now the consulates are bent upon abusing the 221(g). Its like a tit for tat game. 221(g)'s best weapon is Employer-Employee relationship. And, the weapon could be definitely be defeated with a close to perfect documentation. Documentation explaining the EER is the key. This may hold true irrespective of any model viz. EC/EVC/EVVC.

--- from a 221(g) victim for 2.5 months.

If you are a full time employee in some american company and you are already in US (H4 to H1), with NO consulting word associated with you whatsoever, what kind of documents should we get from company to fulfill the needs of: EER (Employer employee relationship) ? will Employment Verification lette works ?

[hmaster]

Everyone doesn't prefer being a FTP, there are folks that prefer being consultants, I really don't feel there is anything wrong being a consultant as long as law permits, which it does.

I really don't understand why are we wasting time in useless arguments, I feel the scope of the discussions in this forums should be to help each other out by sharing valuable inputs based on past successful experiences and not by criticizing different models (EVC or EVVC or EC) or each others situations.

[abhishekreddy1]

JoeF:

I meant to say, companies will have to keep generating work for full timers by bidding for new projects or by creating new products if they r product based company. They do not have the luxury of firing the full timers when they do not have any more projects or when the economy gets bad. It will damage company's reputation and their stock value if they fire them.

[ottawa_rocks]

Capri06: I do not agree with you at all.

Example: i was a "SLAVE" just like you guys out here in EVC MODEL of a DESI employer owned DESI consultancy.

Yes, the reason i said SLAVE is because "REALITY is that YOU GUYS ARE SLAVES" who are literally "OWNED" by those DESI EMPLOYERS and treated like GARBAGE.

EXAMPLE: how many of you ever got your gc started on time. You have to be a LOYAL SLAVE for a MINIMUM of 5 years and bend down to their wishes, cry for every DIME, $ to be increased, play cheap and pathetic tax saving per-diem fraud games, beg for your own money and then ENJOY the SO CALLED LIFE..huh

wake up....this THREAD is about WAKING U INDIANS UP who are continuing to be some other DESI's SLAVE just because you want things easy and then start CRYING AS HE STARTS EXPLOITING YOU (THE same guy who you thought of as a GOD as he threw bread in front of you).

NOBODY is saying, do FTE jobs and do not do CONSULTANCY., do consultancy the right way, not by being a PUPPET OR a slave

BOYCOTT DESI BAZAR ! DESI EMPLOYERS and live your american dream the right way or continue to cry about 221g , USCIS Site visits, audits, INS scams and what not....!!!

[DontWorryBeHappy]

@JoeF Thanks for your contribution to this forum. I have learned a lot about the US immigration from different sections of this Murthy forum. These days it became a routine for me to run through all the sections in this and learn some new things everyday.

Coming to topic, One thing that is puzzling to most of us is that "Why USCIS is approving the petitions in the first place?". Would be glad to know your insights on this.

[maverick33]

@ashman2012 ,

To my knowledge, the I-129 is the key document for any model to explain the EER. The LCA, paystubs, offer letters, client-vendor contract agreements (for EC/EVC) etc will serve as supporting documents. Generally, your attorney who compiles the document for filing the petition on behalf of your company should have knowledge about how to present the EER in the I-129. Hope it helps.