H1-B Denied in Hyderabad

[adiludm@gmail.com]

Hi here is my case.

Visa Date--13th Oct

Model --- E-V-C

Consulate ---Hyderabad

Questions :

VO : Where did u stay?

Me: ANSWERED

VO: Which company will you work for?

Me:ANSWERED

Asked me to go to other counter.16.There were 3 officers standing there.

VO: Which company

VO: Which client

VO: Is there any vendor

VO: Who will control your work

VO: Who provides the work related accessories

VO: What is your end client product

VO: Do you work on end client product

VO: How will your employer know about your progress.

Asked me to wait for 20 mins and then called my name and handed over the passport with letter saying that please apply H1B directly from the client next time

Now please advice what do I do. Please

[forumman]

@adil: Are you a first time H1b applicant going from India ?

[dream16]

Please let us know more about your situation:

1. Have you ever visited AMERICA?

2. Is the new process involves 3 officers instead of 1 to take the interview?

[adiludm@gmail.com]

My visa rejected in June.that was my stamping. again now a new petition

[JoeF]

Well, the Neufeld memo has pretty much killed the EVC concept. The employer has to have control over your work, and with a vendor in between employer and client, that is pretty much impossible. The client only deals with the vendor and would not know anything about your employer.

Find either a direct job with a company that develops and markets products, or, if you go with a consultant, find one that has direct clients.

[h1b321]

I understand that the Neufeld Memo was intended to fill the shortage of employment at the direct client site but as the H1B process evolved the dynamics of the market has changed. First and foremost there are many genuine temp contract jobs where there is a contractor required for very short term duration clients are ready to pay the contractor rather than hiring and firing a permanent resource. Now this multi tier business model is a food chain ...when the govt wants to kill this model they are also killing jobs. In my case the work I do has lot of open position for the locals but unfortunately there is no local talent available to fill these requirements.

Luckily my employer has managed to get the job outsourced and I am getting paid decently. Now my taxes will be paid to the Indian govt , client has saved about 50% of the cost but the vendor who is an pure 100% american company has at least taken a hit of 5K per month.......

so I wonder the underemployment issue is being resolved or additional issues are being created ??

I am totally against keeping employees on bench and all kind of sham policies , govt has the right to audit that but EVC and EVVC models are food chains killing this model is totally senseless.Anyone from this industry will not support it at all, except for the Indian IT companies which are pushing for visa increase but have a work around now. I was told that USCIS has approved my petition in error so USCIS is making a wrong decisions on all the applicants who are workin on the EVC or EVVC model ??? Ya right ....if this is the case someone is sleeping on the job............or the memo is written as per the 90's market .....where the GC process took 1 -2 yrs .. ... I hope at least the GC process will be streamlined now ........

[mf1]

@JoeF

Well said.

But I still don't understand what a staffing company supposed to do?

Why don't government close those companies!

[h1b321]

I understand that the Neufeld Memo was intended to fill the shortage of employment at the direct client site but as the H1B process evolved the dynamics of the market has changed. First and foremost there are many genuine temp contract jobs where there is a contractor required for very short term duration clients are ready to pay the contractor rather than hiring and firing a permanent resource. Now this multi tier business model is a food chain ...when the govt wants to kill this model they are also killing jobs. In my case the work I do has lot of open position for the locals but unfortunately there is no local talent available to fill these requirements.

Luckily my employer has managed to get the job outsourced and I am getting paid decently. Now my taxes will be paid to the Indian govt , client has saved about 50% of the cost but the vendor who is an pure 100% american company has at least taken a hit of 5K per month.......

so I wonder the underemployment issue is being resolved or additional issues are being created ??

I am totally against keeping employees on bench and all kind of sham policies , govt has the right to audit that but EVC and EVVC models are food chains killing this model is totally senseless.Anyone from this industry will not support it at all, except for the Indian IT companies which are pushing for visa increase but have a work around now. I was told that USCIS has approved my petition in error so USCIS is making a wrong decisions on all the applicants who are workin on the EVC or EVVC model ??? Ya right ....if this is the case someone is sleeping on the job............or the memo is written as per the 90's market .....where the GC process took 1 -2 yrs .. ... I hope at least the GC process will be streamlined now ........

[dream16]

great post h1b321: i don't think people actually understand why EVC exist. Look around guys, most of the talent comes through EVC, killing it will kill your own business & it will be too late then as china & other developing nations will surpass you by then

[tar53]

@h1b321

I'm with you, but nothing can't be done to change the current system.

[adiludm@gmail.com]

@ JoeF ... When they say that my case is being sent back to USCIS for revocation and Visa is denied.

Would USCIS again look in to my petition. How soon my petition will reach USCIS. And can i still work remotely? Or ask my employer to file for H1-B again with direct client.

Kindly advice. Or can I forget about H1 and apply for F1.

[JoeF]

@JoeF

Well said.

But I still don't understand what a staffing company supposed to do?

They would have to stop being a staffing company, or hire Americans.

Why don't government close those companies!

Staffing companies are not illegal. They just can't hire people on H1 if they can't show an employer-employee relationship.

And you have to understand that this has come about because of rather massive abuse of the H1 by staffing companies.

Abuse always comes back to bite. Lots of people, including me, have warned about that for a decade. People didn't want to listen, so now they have to face the consequences.

[JoeF]

I understand that the Neufeld Memo was intended to fill the shortage of employment at the direct client site but as the H1B process evolved the dynamics of the market has changed.

Yes, it has. There are now H1s available for people who really have a job.

A few years back the H1 quota got filled within days just because shady consultants filed tons of H1s for jobs that didn't exist.

Abuse is always coming back to bite.

The only solution is to not abuse the H1 program.

[vidhya18]

@ Adil ,

Sorry to hear about it . This really scares me a lot as I am also planning for my second attempt .... Oh God !! This is seriously crazy !! I don't know how do they expect us to file from the direct client ? or find some one who has direct clients ,if we do that also don't you think they have "N" of questions for us ?

Can you please tell me what would be the best answers for the last but 2 questions from your experience say if are on EC model ?

Thanks ,

Vidhya !!

[gogokool]

Thanks for the insight into Neufeld Memo in various posts. Is there a way we can communicate to USCIS to take this into consideration during H1B approval rather than at Consular Posts.

That might be loss of revenue,... so are they indirectly encouraging some abuse?

[JoeF]

great post h1b321: i don't think people actually understand why EVC exist. Look around guys, most of the talent comes through EVC

No, most talent doesn't come through EVC.

Talents go to real companies. Talents don't go working for consulting companies as the 28497th VB or Web programmer.

[adiludm@gmail.com]

@JoeF Can I apply H1-B again from a same company with a direct client or another employer. I have been rejected twice in this year. Can I apply H1 at all? Please advice

[adiludm@gmail.com]

@ vidhya. According to consulate your clients product should benefit your employer.

[JoeF]

@JoeF Can I apply H1-B again from a same company with a direct client or another employer. I have been rejected twice in this year. Can I apply H1 at all? Please advice

If there is an employer-employee relationship, e.g., when working for a company with products, or a consultant with a direct client, it is of course possible to get an H1.

It is just that the Neufeld memo essentially has killed EVC-style stuff.

[JoeF]

@ Adil ,

Sorry to hear about it . This really scares me a lot as I am also planning for my second attempt .... Oh God !! This is seriously crazy !! I don't know how do they expect us to file from the direct client ? or find some one who has direct clients

Why would that be hard? Lots of people do that.

You apply at real companies... why would you limit your job search to consulting companies?

[vidhya18]

@Joef ,

Yes lot of people do apply to real companies , but right now I am India . If I was in USA that used to be a definitely a very different story ...Even though if I take calls and clear an Interview my client wouldn't wait for me for More than 2 weeks and as you know how long the visa process is these days and I have no option just to go with consulting firm as of now ..

Thanks ,

Vidhya !!

[h1b321]

@ JoeF

I am not sure what do u mean by a real job ?? getting paid from an employer who is compliant with legal laws and appraises like any end client isn't a real job ? I agree with you or xyz who claimed employer should have the control over the employee, but as long as this is being demonstrated and exercised, what seems to be the problem when you are working with technology partner companies ? I respectfully disagree with your comment that EVC model does not bring in talent. The ground reality is that the best breed of IT professionals come from the consulting background as they have a lot of exposure from different clients and various projects and that's the "real value add" my friend for any project. I think spending 5-8 years siting on one chair will make you very limited to that particular client. I do not work directly for a Big Indian implementer but I manage their team , a team which has been brought from India after going thru "BEP" I hate to tell this but the talent is totally unfit for a consulting position. Just think about it how many locals will relocate from state to state seeking employment ? . Ok I agree the program was abused by some people .... you have mentioned the quota getting filled up the first day by all bogus jobs ....fine ...agreed....but please dont forget the 3 times larger quota which actually had clogged the GC system and forced ppl to stick to desi companies.....any clean up without a proper process improvement initiative bites.....we as Indians will survive anywhere in the world after going thru this insanity ....as long as I pay my taxes I have the right to protect my dreams ......so I think the double standard of the system is something exactly like what the shady consultants did for revenue .... I don't understand how can there be multiple interpretations of one simple document (Neu Memo) ....USCIS has its own interpretation ....DHS has its own interpretation .....attorney has his own interpretation ......WTH man ! is this written in some kind of complex java code or something ........I dont think so ......... if the EVC model is killed then many of the attorneys will soon work on traffic tickets ...... and one more note ....any product development company (midsize business) cannot fully fund its projects without consulting. consulting + product development go hand in hand ..... its a high risk for the bank to fund the project in this market ... especially in the down turn so where will the money come from? China ?? hmm .....just think ....as long as the agreement between a EVC model gives the employer the right to control the employee with a strict non-compete or non solicitation with the client ......whats the problem ? the employer can handle this in presence of the vendor ...........yes I totally agree with you that there are many companies who sponsor H1B's for direct employment, but as per the latest market trend all the support work is outsourced to one single technology vendor. This is eating up the real jobs .....the govt should put a cap on this ......and control it .. ...then the client will think of hiring locals ...but I think these ppl have a strong lobby .......its Ok as long as they provide good talent but they are not !! and very soon this will be researched about and will be public information.....at that time the ambiguous Neu memo will be amended ....I feel someone is carrying the ladder horizontally ;) .....

@Adil and all my friends who are stuck because of these rules try your best but enjoy ur stay in India nothing is larger than life ,,,this is very difficult for ppl who were on real jobs as the calculations in the mind don't stop ...."but consider this as a vacation and have trust in God that what ever is good for you happens to you " stay sharp, pray .. and have faith in America someone will realize these mistakes and give us a fair shot again ....that's what is great about USA.

[dream16]

Hi Vidhya, what's your email? we need to talk

[JoeF]

@ JoeF

I am not sure what do u mean by a real job ?? getting paid from an employer who is compliant with legal laws and appraises like any end client isn't a real job ? I agree with you or xyz who claimed employer should have the control over the employee, but as long as this is being demonstrated and exercised

Well, this thread is about where it can not be demonstrated.

It is practically impossible for the employer to have control over the employees work in an EVC setting.

Ever heard of non-disclosures? If you are working in an EVC setting and tell your employer about the details of your work, you most likely violate a non-disclosure agreement.

A client can not allow that their internal procedures etc. become known to some arbitrary people. These people could be competitors.

[JoeF]

@Joef ,

Yes lot of people do apply to real companies , but right now I am India . If I was in USA that used to be a definitely a very different story ...Even though if I take calls and clear an Interview my client wouldn't wait for me for More than 2 weeks and as you know how long the visa process is these days and I have no option just to go with consulting firm as of now ..

If an employer really wants to hire you, they wait for the visa to clear. And, they could allow you to work remotely from your home country in the mean time. There is this thing called the Internet...