Parents Visitor Visa rejection with 214(b)

[genius2018]

I am on H1B status since 2011 with approved petition till 2020 and GC is under process (I-140 Approved), also I have stamping done last year in India. I am currently in California.

My father is a farmer and my mother is a Homemaker. My father’s age is 65 years and mother’s 63 years.

My parents have 3 kids, one myself, working in USA, other two are my brother and sister both married and living in India.  

My father possession land, plots and is having own house in India.

I applied for their visitor visa and they attended interview on 05-April-2018 at Mumbai consulate, India.

I was sponsoring the trip and I have enough balance in my US bank account.

They have all the required documents as below:
I134s
Copy of H1B Approval
Copy of passport
Employment Letter
Copy of last three bank statements
Bank Account verification letter
Copy of last three salary Statements
Copy of last two years Tax returns.
Property papers (for my parent’s properties in India).

During interview they just asked 4 questions:

Que: what is your occupation?
Ans: Farmer

Que: Who stays in US?

Ans: Our son

 

Que: Where in US?

Ans: California

 

Que: What is your son doing?

Ans: He is working as software engineer.

 

Without asking any more question they got rejection with 214(b). They didn’t ask for any document. Without asking how you will you prove your ties. According to 214(b), applicant should have ties to their home country and have reason to come back to own country.

As my parents have their own properties in India. They have 2 kids and also have grand kids in India.

 

I want to re-apply their visa in next month. Please advise how to overcome 214(b) and get the approval.

What more details should I add to my application?

 

 Provided below details in my Ds-160:

Travel Information

The List of Purposes of Trip to the U.S.

Purpose of Trip to the U.S. (1): TEMP. BUSINESS PLEASURE VISITOR (B)

Specify: BUSINESS & TOURISM (TEMPORARY VISITOR) (B1/B2)

Have you made specific travel plans? NO

Intended Date of Arrival: 30 APRIL 2018

Intended Length of Stay in U.S.: 2 MONTH(S)

Work/Education/Training Information

Primary Occupation: AGRIC ULTURE

Present Employer or School Name: SELF - FARMER

Briefly Describe your Duties: FARMING, GROWING, IRRIGATING AND

HARVESTING C ROPS SUC H AS WHEAT, MUSTARD,

CASTOR, ETC

[pontevecchio]

Documents do not matter. They determine credibility in a couple of minutes based on experience and also their likes and dislikes. You could discuss the matter with the firm of Murthy in Chennai. The prevailing political winds do have an effect on Consulate staff who belong to one or the other philosophy.

[JoeF]

There is no sponsorship for visitors. Paying for the trip isn't sponsoring.

And bank balance means nothing. It is well known that money can be moved into and out of a bank account at the spur of the moment.

Also, you don't apply for a visa. They apply. They need to be able to convince the officer that they will return to their home country.

Coaching is also bad.

Edited April 6, 2018 by JoeF

[genius2018]

Now I want to re-apply for their visa but this time the situation is totally changed, my wife was critically ill and passed away in mid of May-2018. So, me and my daughter (9 years old) want my parents to stay with us in USA for few months so that we get emotional support and help us to overcome grief and depression.

Any suggestion on how to reapply for my parents’ visitor visa?

[genius2018]

Thanks for your reply.

Yes, you are true, actually my parents cannot stay more than 2 months because my father needs to manage his farming occupation.

 We are planning for  6-8 weeks trip. 

We want reapply it again showing they are self-sponsoring their trip. My father has bank balance around 10 lakhs (I transferred 5 lakhs to his account in May 2018)

How many months of bank statement we need?  

What documents we need to prove the self-sponsorship? 

Can I fill DS-160 form for my parents? 

Please suggest either I should sponsor them again or they do their own sponsorship.

 

[genius2018]

On 4/5/2018 at 8:29 PM, Noah Lott said:

All of those documents you listed are YOURS, not theirs....YOUR documents and situation is not being adjudicated...it's your parents' situation on the table...you offering to pay the freight does not enhance anyone's chances of overcoming 214b, nor did anything you sent with them alleviate any concerns of the CO that they might decide to take up some sort of work in the US...whether child care or managing the front desk of a motel...and when is the growing season of all those crops? How can a farmer abandon his farm while stuff is supposed to be growing, etc???

I suspect they were asked more than the 4 questions listed....a lot of people whose applications were denied tell a hard to believe story about how they were not asked any questions or just 2 or something like that....the questions listed above would not have been sufficient to make a judgment call....no one asked how long they planned to stay (I think they did), or who would mind the farm in their absence (also I believe that was asked)..

And as Joe said, you do not apply for anything on their behalf - they apply (and qualify) on their own.

One more question asked was who will book your air ticket? 

My father answer our son will book it for us. Do you see anything wrong if child book ticket for parents?

[Provence]

On 4/5/2018 at 10:49 PM, JoeF said:

There is no sponsorship for visitors. Paying for the trip isn't sponsoring.

And bank balance means nothing. It is well known that money can be moved into and out of a bank account at the spur of the moment.

Also, you don't apply for a visa. They apply. They need to be able to convince the officer that they will return to their home country.

Coaching is also bad.

Exactly!  As OP claims to have done so very recently. 

[Provence]

11 hours ago, genius2018 said:

Thanks for your reply.

Yes, you are true, actually my parents cannot stay more than 2 months because my father needs to manage his farming occupation.

 We are planning for  6-8 weeks trip. 

We want reapply it again showing they are self-sponsoring their trip. My father has bank balance around 10 lakhs (I transferred 5 lakhs to his account in May 2018)

How many months of bank statement we need?  

What documents we need to prove the self-sponsorship? 

Can I fill DS-160 form for my parents? 

Please suggest either I should sponsor them again or they do their own sponsorship.

 

You're missing the point..

Please go over previous posts in this thread. The word "sponsorship" does not apply to tourist visas. You do not sponsor anyone to visit the US. Your parents could pay for their trip (technically you are paying by transferring money to their accounts to pad the balance, and the US embassy has ways of reviewing a transaction history if they choose to). 

Yes, you can help fill out their ds160. Other than that, best for you to stay out of the process. 

In the event they're denied again, perhaps your daughter and you could look into travelling to India for emotional support. I'm sure you could get time off work following the loss of a spouse.

Condolences on your loss.

[cap-gap]

People need to get off their high horse..Majority of Indians applying for B2 visa are doing so bcz their children invite them..actually the parents get forced to apply..even if they get visa, these wilted, non English speaking parents loathe and dread a second visit to US let alone the concept of permanently settling down there..

Couple of years ago it was a moment of agape at Terminal 2 in Changi international airport which is an almost exclusive terminal for Indian departure flights..just standing room only with returning Indian tourists carrying loads of shopping sacks carrying fashion merchandise.. talked to few of them they don’t even care to apply for US B2 visa..clearly US loss..

[genius2018]

On 7/13/2018 at 11:45 AM, Noah Lott said:

Dumping $$$ into a third party's account is a oft-tried scheme...COs have seen it before...it will not enhance your parents' chances of success...

How to show the strong ties because most of the time VO even don’t ask such details.

Even in DS-160 they don’t have question where we can describe that my parents have land and house in India.

For reapply in ds-160 for job description I am going to write "Managing land based assets for productive profitable crop yields".

Can you please suggest what I can write so that it show strong ties?

 

Thanks in advance.

[Provence]

An applicant is the only individual who knows their circumstances. It's unlikely strangers on a public forum could advise you on specifics. Fill out the ds160 to the best of your knowledge and have your folks reapply. Or, alternatively, as suggested earlier, your daughter and you look into traveling to your parents if their visa attempts aren't successful. 

[Provence]

5 hours ago, Noah Lott said:

PLease note that I have not offered specific advice on how one might obtain a B2 visa.....I have merely suggested that telling the truth, whatever it may be, is the best way to approach an interview, and any or all attempts to try and outwit a CO will likely fail...remember, the COs enter interview notes into their computer system....and you do not want some phrase like ' lacks credibility because of........."...or 'showed me a phony bank account with money recently deposited in it from the US'....or 'someone wrte..'managing land based assets....blah blah blah...'...clearly not the words of the applicant,....applicant unwilling to answer specifics without referring to letters or notes from relatives....'...

any of those or similar phrases will label the applicant as  someone who is uncomfortable telling the truth...and that is the surest way to fail again in the future at another interview....

I wasn't commenting on your post. Rather on OP's post seeking specific suggestions for the ds160. 

@Noah Lott I agree with the content of your posts, backed by experience; and while posts may come across as harsh, they are arguably facts without sugarcoating. A majority of the audience on this forum may not been quite as keen on that, I suppose. 

[cap-gap]

3 hours ago, Provence said:

 

@Noah Lott I agree with the content of your posts, backed by experience; and while posts may come across as harsh, they are arguably facts without sugarcoating. A majority of the audience on this forum may not been quite as keen on that, I suppose. 

The hotel owner in Vegas or the fancy restaurant owner on the south beach survive on (foreign) tourists “arriving” and spending their hard earned money to run his business..not on the vivid paranoia of a CO that stands in the way of their business revenues..and definitely not on that of an ex CO... (on the contrary, the foreign mission posts are paid by these tax payers if not by the foreigners’ B2 application fees..) the world has rapidly evolved to be a global economy in the last decade and obviously few old timers are unable to comprehend..

as I said, check out Changi terminal B.. they seem to don’t mind these foreign spending flooding in..by the way dinosaurs are known to extinct bcz they failed to adopt to evolution..

[cap-gap]

And c’on .. enuf with the misleading statements..in this day of credit cards and e- transactions and steaming economy who will keep cash in their banks for two years leading up to a mere B2 interview to prove something..indians invest on real estate in India duh..

[Provence]

12 hours ago, cap-gap said:

The hotel owner in Vegas or the fancy restaurant owner on the south beach survive on (foreign) tourists “arriving” and spending their hard earned money to run his business..not on the vivid paranoia of a CO that stands in the way of their business revenues..and definitely not on that of an ex CO... (on the contrary, the foreign mission posts are paid by these tax payers if not by the foreigners’ B2 application fees..) the world has rapidly evolved to be a global economy in the last decade and obviously few old timers are unable to comprehend..

as I said, check out Changi terminal B.. they seem to don’t mind these foreign spending flooding in..by the way dinosaurs are known to extinct bcz they failed to adopt to evolution..

Boy o boy.. how about sticking to visa-related topics; personal denigration doesn't add value to a discussion. Paranoia/old timers.. really? 

Every CO, not just the one posting here, has to balance the odds of a B2 applicant returning home; that's a requirement codified in US law. COs are human, they have to make a decision based on the ds160 and the interview. Last I checked, a B2 visa is for tourism, family visits, etc. Every foreign visitor to the US is welcome to spend money and sightsee; most do, and exit the US on time. But what about those who forget to return? A 6-week promise at an interview suddenly changes into a 6-month "visit" as soon as the visa is issued. One only needs to browse the B2 to COS/AOS threads on different forums. 

Sure, folks are welcome to travel to Singapore, or any welcoming nation. But why are there still huge NIV lines outside US embassies if Changi has tourists flooding in? Agreed, it's helpful to evolve as practical, but I don't see the US going by the way of dinosaurs anytime soon. 

I'm sure the OP isn't happy his thread got hijacked away from his discussion. 

[Ken7]

But isn't the system flawed to begin with? Isn't it setup for pushing people to have to lie/find ways to overcome shortcomings? As experienced CO's or for that matter anyone with some general knowledge of India, would know that a lot (possibly a majority) of the children pay for their parent's visit. Also, most of the Indian parents travel to see their children and not stay back. Yet, there is that burden of proof (that a lot of Indian parents/families don't possess) that is required at the time of the interview.

[pontevecchio]

Contrary to established wisdom, have them get an Interview in English next time. Most Indians can speak some English. It is only an opinion. Try it. I would also add this is not rocket science. Your coaching could be the problem. In 2 minutes of eye contact they decide yes or No. A vast majority are approved. Only those who have a problem come here.

[JoeF]

5 hours ago, Ken7 said:

But isn't the system flawed to begin with? Isn't it setup for pushing people to have to lie/find ways to overcome shortcomings? As experienced CO's or for that matter anyone with some general knowledge of India, would know that a lot (possibly a majority) of the children pay for their parent's visit. Also, most of the Indian parents travel to see their children and not stay back. Yet, there is that burden of proof (that a lot of Indian parents/families don't possess) that is required at the time of the interview.

The system isn't just for Indians. It is the same for all foreigners.

All people applying for a visa are presumed immigrants unless and until they can show otherwise to the satisfaction of the officer processing the application. Immigration law, INA 101.

[Ken7]

12 hours ago, JoeF said:

The system isn't just for Indians. It is the same for all foreigners.

All people applying for a visa are presumed immigrants unless and until they can show otherwise to the satisfaction of the officer processing the application. Immigration law, INA 101.

Yes, which is why it's inherently flawed. While the law is same for all, as it needs to be, it's application needs to have some discretion. Who's to say someone with money in the bank will not stay back, and someone with little money is more likely to? Denying parents a visa to see family just based on financial metrics  is flawed imo.  

[JoeF]

2 hours ago, Ken7 said:

Yes, which is why it's inherently flawed. While the law is same for all, as it needs to be, it's application needs to have some discretion. Who's to say someone with money in the bank will not stay back, and someone with little money is more likely to? Denying parents a visa to see family just based on financial metrics  is flawed imo.  

You don't get special treatment just because you are from a particular country. That's a fundamental thing in laws.

[cap-gap]

3 hours ago, JoeF said:

You don't get special treatment just because you are from a particular country. That's a fundamental thing in laws.

Say whattt?? There are countries on the ban list and there are countries on the visa waiver list..

they do B2 interviews in local languages.. understanding local culture is not tougher than learning local language..

[Provence]

7 hours ago, Ken7 said:

Yes, which is why it's inherently flawed. While the law is same for all, as it needs to be, it's application needs to have some discretion. Who's to say someone with money in the bank will not stay back, and someone with little money is more likely to? Denying parents a visa to see family just based on financial metrics  is flawed imo.  

That discretion you speak of is referred to as a consular officer or a CBP officer. If merited, it's that discretion, for example, that allows a CO to approve a visa for a young, single, jobless applicant who might otherwise not have qualified for a B2. 

A visa is a privilege.. and there's nothing stopping an individual from traveling to India to see family. 

[JoeF]

4 hours ago, cap-gap said:

Say whattt?? There are countries on the ban list and there are countries on the visa waiver list..

they do B2 interviews in local languages.. understanding local culture is not tougher than learning local language..

The ban list is about countries that support terrorism. The visa waiver list is about countries that have a low number of visa violators.

Local language interviews are lot limited to particular countries.

Local cultures don't matter. Some countries allow polygamy, the US won't allow that. US culture matters for travel to the US. There is no right to a US visa, just as there is no right to an Indian visa. So, get off your high horse.

In this case, the OP can always travel to his home country to see his family.

[cap-gap]

12 hours ago, JoeF said:

The ban list is about countries that support terrorism. The visa waiver list is about countries that have a low number of visa violators.

Local language interviews are lot limited to particular countries 

You made my point by contradicting with your own previous statement..

if you want to make a logical argument, why don’t you dig up the statistics on how many F1 visa holders actually returned after MS vs how many B2 visa holders from India overstayed?

I know those statistics..the scrutiny on B2 is just ridiculous and illogical in light of those statistics..

[JoeF]

Huh? Now you bring up a non-sequitur about people on F1. Not returning by changing to another status is quite different from overstaying. Apples and oranges.